The 4 Systems Every Hairstylist Needs To Scale in 2025

Hello, my friend. Welcome back to the Modern Hair Stylist podcast. We have Jodi again here with us today. What's going on, Jodi?

Hey, hey. I'm excited to be here. Dude, I'm excited to have you here. So y'all know if you've been listening to the past couple episodes, uh, that we've had Jodi on the podcast, 'cause her and I met up in Vancouver, and we were able to, uh, batch a bunch of episodes together.

And you guys absolutely freaking loved it. So Jodi, uh, for now is going to be a repeat guest a couple more times with us, and, uh, I'm really, really excited to have her here, just because she is a, she has a hairdresser background herself. And she also, because she works within my business and sees a lot of your guys' questions for me and how you interact with me and what you guys have going on, um, she's able to, you know, offer me that perspective while I'm recording the episode. So that way I can really speak directly to you and personalize th- these episodes as much as I possibly can.

And so, in today's episode, we're gonna be addressing the fact that shit is never-endingly changing in this industry, and that very much includes clients' expectations and how clients are choosing to work with salons, whether or not they are going to decide to include you in their budget, right, or look for a cheaper option, or whatever it may be. And with these expectations increasing and with your responsibilities seemingly, uh, increasing as well to a unmanageable level, um, I think it's really important that we visit the conversation of departmentalizing our business and really looking at our business as a business, period, but also a business that has multiple departments. 'Cause if you look at any other industry, business within those industries, they have a marketing d- department. They have a client experience department.

They have a sales department. They have an operations department. They have an HR, right? And all of those people, they have whole teams running each of those departments to make sure that that specific part of the business is running absolutely optimally so that way the business can succeed very well, right?

Where you are just one human being who has to handle it all. And so I think it is really powerful for us to get really focused on specifically the department in our business that would move the needle forward the most so that we aren't giving each of the departments only 20% to see none of our efforts actually get us past the hump that we might be experiencing. And, and furthermore, allows us to meet clients' ever-changing expectations within that department that may be the one that you may be lacking in the most right now. And so, we're gonna be breaking down what each of those departments are for you today, and why they matter, and how it affects the consumer behavior in relation to your business and the industry as a whole.

How's that sound, Jodi? I think this is the perfect conversation, because as, you know, we've seen a lot in our industry, the conversation around how many responsibilities hairstylists have now when they're running independent businesses. The best part about this departmentalizing your business is there might be something that you're doing that you don't even need to really think about. Like, it's working.

It's good. You've got it on lock, especially with what you teach, Hunter. Like, there's a lot of automating, and there's a lot of systems set up. And so, I'm really excited to dig into this, because I feel as though w- the way that you're gonna lay this out today, it's going to show your listeners that they maybe don't actually need to be in all of these departments all the time.

And so, I think that the best way to start is let's introduce what those departments are, um, and, you know, what they include inside of the hairstylist business. Cool. So, I try to simplify all of this stuff as much as I possibly can, right, to make sure that, you know, you as somebody who's already possibly a little bit overwhelmed with being a business owner can make it a little bit more digestible for you. Um, and so, you know, if we were to look at another business outside of the industry, they would probably have much more departments than the ones that I'm gonna break down here.

Um, but I like to consolidate it basically into four. Um, one is basically just your foundational part of your business. Um, that's where we look at your pricing. That's where we look at your policies.

That's where we look at your brand. Um, and then we have marketing, which is all about getting new clients and keep, making it so that flow of new clients is coming in, and then also making it so a little bit of your clients actually coming back as well too. Um, and then we have your client experience and sales. I like to take sales, which is the art of, you know, actually selling your product, and I like to look at, uh, uh, our version of sales as, you know, add-ons and retail sales.

I like to put that in the same department as client experience as a whole, because you're selling those things with your client experience. And also, your client experience isn't thriving unless you have the sales aspect as a included part of it. Um, and then lastly, we have your operations, and your operations is some administrative stuff, and a lot of it has to do with client communication, onboarding, and, uh, streamlining that as much as possible to make it smooth and great for both you and the client. So, here's my first question for you, Hunter.

Where is the, the department that you feel like maybe a lot of independent stylists aren't maxing out in the way that they could be? Um, I think that people definitely are missing the mark as far as what is needed right now-... in client experience, but not necessarily with the in-the-chair experience. Mm-hmm.

It's about what happens outside of the chair. Um, it's the least tapped-into space where hairstylists and beauty professionals have the chance to set themselves apart, and it's also actually the biggest threat to your success as a business owner when it comes to our industry and clients looking for cheaper alternatives. So, when you are looking at what's happening in today's day and age, we have a bunch of really easy-to-access free resources for your client to go and figure out how can they cut their own hair at home, or how can they color their own hair at home from these YouTube tutorials, right? Um, and then you have companies who have sponsored ads that will sh- say, "Hey, we will custom formulate these products f- just for you, and we'll send them right to your door and tell y- and send you videos for exactly how you can use them."

Um, or the big bad one is is, like, eh, for example, Madison Reed. It's not the only company out there, but Box Color Company, and, and Madison Reed, but Madison Reed is really taking it to a whole nother level where the messaging is, is like salon-quality color at home. And you have licensed cosmetologists getting on the f- the video call with their customers showing them how to do their own hair at home, right? So, you have all of these companies, right?

And all of these outside sources and resources that your clients could lean into instead for more cost-effective options for the result that they're trying to achieve that they normally pay you for, and those people, guess where they're showing up? In your client's inbox, on their feed, n- and, and also in physical advertisement spill boards on your, on their TV, nonstop. You're with your client for maybe around two hours on average, for a c- an average color client, right? In those two hours, yes, absolutely, it is so important that we blow them away, and we can talk way more about that, right?

Like, I mean, there's so many things that we can do to make sure that our client experience is really matching the price that we're charging people, um, and then some. But, o- when it comes to those two hours, you only have that much time to really make it so that person has full attention with you. And think about all of the hours that pass by between when your client leaves and when they come back to see you for the first time, and how much opportunity these other companies have to get in front of your client's face and hit their pain points, and use that exact messaging. "You don't have to go to the salon anymore.

Come get this for the same quality, but cheaper and less time." Right? And I'm not saying that you have to show up as much as they are, 'cause it's just absolutely impossible, but I am saying that we need to be showing up in one way or another, and then of course, there's ways that I teach to make it manageable, automated, streamlined, but yet still personalized and effective. And so, I think that that's honestly the most neglected, most opportune, and honestly, most urgent place, uh, is the, is the client experience department, but not necessarily the in-the-chair, but the outside-of-the-chair parts of it.

Yes. That makes a lot of sense. I think when stylists hear "client experience," they're still thinking about, like, the, the drinks that you're offering, and, like, yes, those are part of it, but I love how you kind of illustrated what that experience is and where that extends to. And I think upon hearing that, a lot of, a lot of stylists would think about the fact that, like, "Okay, does this mean that I just need to be, like, on, like, in marketing, you know, all the time?"

Like, how do you diagnose if that's the area that you should be spending your time in, or if maybe there's another department in your specific business that needs your attention? Yeah, so this all comes down to numbers, and actually understanding your numbers is a part of your foundations department, by my definition. But making sure that you have a good grasp on your numbers will allow you to diagnose where the problem is. So, let's say you have a problem.

The problem is, "I need more clients," right? Um, or let's say that the problem is, "I have a bunch of gaps in my schedule and I really wanna fill them." And so maybe an example of this could be, "I have, I have gaps in my schedule and I wanna fill them. What is wrong?"

And so you think that you need more new clients because new clients would fill in those gaps, right? But you're getting, let's say you have data points that show you you are getting new client requests, right? You know that they're, where they're coming from. Your marketing efforts are working well.

But if you run your new client retention rate, right, then that actually shows you it's a retention problem and that's why you have these gaps in your schedule versus you don't need any new clients. And actually, that will illuminate to you that you have a huge problem because all of your efforts in getting those new clients into your chair are completely going to waste, and you are losing a ton of money because of it, and losing out on the, uh, the stability that a higher retention number could offer you in the long run. And so, it really comes down to numbers, and when you are in a space of being a lonely business owner, 'cause being a business owner is fucking lonely, and you are possibly leaning into education, you're leaning into resources such as my podcast, or social media, or whatever it may be, and you have tons of different influencers telling you to focus on all these different things, it's really hard to understand what the priority is. Everything feels urgent, right?

Yes. I'm sure you listening to this feel like everything feels urgent. So, a lot of the times, we are, we are very reactive and we just react to what feels urgent right in front of us instead of really taking a step back from an outside perspective, a calm, analytical perspective, and focusing on what is the most important thing right now. And you're not gonna be able to diagnose what that is unless you have good numbers to show you those things.

Right now, I'm on the mod- Modern Hairstylist Tour...... um, I'm, like, basically right in the middle of it. And something that we have our students do at the beginning is they go through a self-assessment. So, I show them, "In each department, these are the types of things that you should be looking at as far as your numbers go, but then also your general behaviors and beliefs as well."

And then we rate them, and then, then it'll show you which department right now is the one that you need to work on the most. And it has been super eye-opening for the students being like, "Oh, my God. This is the, this is the space of my business that I was focusing on. But in actuality, I need to be focusing on this side instead."

Mm-hmm. Right. And a lot of the times, what I'll hear is, is, "This other side was something that maybe felt a little bit uncomfortable for me, so I was avoiding doing the work here, uh, by, by thinking or focusing on all these other things. And now we're ending up in a space where we have to do a lot of, of undigging out of that hole because we have avoided that space for so long, but we didn't even, even realize that it was necessarily a problem."

Um, and, and you know, we're focusing on dopamine release as humans, right? We want, we want rewards, uh, and es- and especially instant rewards. Mm-hmm. And so another thing that I'll oftentimes see when it looks ...

when we're talking about, like, focusing on the right or wrong department is, we, a lot of the times, we'll focus on things that give us instant gratification because the thing- the things that we have to put hard work into, that don't give us that immediate great feedback, such as, like, marketing ... Like, you posting today i- is not necessarily designed to get you a client today. It's designed to get you a client weeks from now, months from now, a year or two from now, right? Um, but a client experience thing where you, uh, work on your in-the-chair experience and you add this new amenity and you roll it out tomorrow and you see clients literally telling you, "This is awesome."

And you see them partaking in it, that feels really good. So ... And furthermore, it's something where we may feel insecure, so we may feel like we need to really justify our prices and we really want people to stick around, so we're gonna add things to the client experience. When in actuality, your client experience is fucking fine.

Your retention number will show you that your client experience is next level. It's what ... But we could be focusing maybe more on the outside-the-chair experience 'cause tha- those are untapped places, um, other things that, you know, aren't necessarily instant gratification. Or we just really need to fucking focus on your marketing, girl, and we've been avoiding that at all costs because it sucks, 'cause it's not fun for anybody.

Right. But it's really freaking important, obviously, right? But you're not gonna know what's on fire until you know what your numbers are and you do some self-assessment. And that's what I love about my programs, is that I'm always making it so that you are getting some individualized attention.

Like, you can get a second set of eyeballs that is somebody who is looking at tons of hairstylist businesses, right, all the time, that can show you maybe where the blind spot is that you can't really see. I know for me, as an entrepreneur, my head is just always spiraling with, with, "I need to do this, I need to do that," and, and it's really difficult to see through the chaos, right? Or even being surrounded by peers who can reflect those things for you as well is so powerful. And so that's why I love that we have that as a part of Modern Stylist movement.

Um, and, uh, I've been able to really, like, reroute people into the right directions, and it's so crazy how much clarity that creates, and so how much more focus that creates, and then how much beautiful results that creates at the end of the day as well too. It's so true, 'cause the running the business part in this industry is a skill in and of itself, and it's not something that you're taught- No. in hair school. Like, when you're getting your ...

You know, when you're learning how to foil hair and do all these things, they're not teaching you about how to run your operation. They're not teaching you, you know, how to build your brand and all of those things. And so I do think it's really, really important that there are educators who are showcasing how to actually run the business, and that's what I think you do such a great job of. Because you can be as creative and the best stylist in the world, but if you're not running your business in a way that's sustainable, you know, it's, it's gonna be really hard to s- to make that a long-term success.

Yeah. And so, I wanted to ask you, too ... It ... I, I think when it comes to these different departments, if this is kind of a new concept for people, this could be one of the, the reasons that they're working so hard and feel like they're doing so much all the time and they're not seeing results.

So, what are ... Like, when, when it comes to that, when it comes to, like, that piece of, of just working so hard and not getting the results, what are you, what do you say to that stylist who's like, "I'm burnt out. Like, how do I even get back to this?" "How do I even make the time to, like, figure out where I need to spend my attention, 'cause I'm just already so busy," you know?

Yeah. Um, I think it's, like, very much just getting real with yourself. And, uh, doing the shit that you just don't feel like doing, you know? I, I, I don't ...

I, I, I have a difficult time coming up with a direct answer for this. But like, genuinely, like, when I, I ... Yes, this happens to me every day. Like, overwhelm happens to me every day.

Everything feels urgent. This happens to me every single day. Like, the feeling does not go away, okay? However, I've set up systems in my life and my business that keep me on track throughout the overwhelm, right?

Through the burnout, right? Mm-hmm. So that way, th- the systems that hold me accountable, systems that make things easy for me, systems that delegate things off of my plate so I don't have to think about them, so I create time and space and energy for the more important things, right? I have built those things into my life as guardrails to make it so I stay on track.

And so for example, everything feels urgent to me right now. There's big projects that we have rolling out, and something really exciting for you guys listening to this as well. And I, and I have made it so, throughout my weeks, I have clear focus time to just focus on those things. And I am building out my week and my schedule in a, in a way where I'm giving the majority of my time, energy, and focus to the thing that needs my, my ...

that needs my ... the most of my attention, the thing that I know is going to move the needle forward the most.But at the same time, I, throughout my days, I have tons of people who are emailing me, DMing me, asking me to get on calls, and I'm not talking about hairstylists. I'm talking about, like, other companies, right, like brands, contractors, like people that I have to, like co- that I am collaborating with.

Really exciting ideas too. Like, I'm, like, talking to, like, a company that I would love to freaking work with right now, and I could be prioritizing them in my time because it feels good or it feels urgent or it feels exciting, right? But I'm being really strict with myself that I set aside this specific time to focus on this thing because I know that that is gonna be the thing that moves the needle most forward in the business. Is it what I want to be doing?

Not necessarily. Is it what I should and have to be doing? Absolutely, yes. And so this company is gonna have to wait a week or two to get on a call with me, and if that doesn't work out, oh, well.

If that's the reason why it doesn't work out for me, oh, well. I know that I'm doing the right thing for me right now, and I've, and I've lived too many... I have too many lived experiences of getting distracted and letting that F up my entire progress and goals- Mm-hmm. to let any more distractions get in the way.

So I built my, I built my systems. I, I planned out my year. I have a, a month by month calendar on when I'm gonna work on things, when the launch is gonna go out, and then I work backwards from that, right? And I make sure that I'm staying on track step by step by step.

So maybe just fucking start by time blocking your week and just making it so, okay, I know that I've been avoiding this bigger thing, and I know that it's the one thing that I need to focus on right now if I really want to start to get things off my plate, if I really wanna start to get the ball ru- rolling, feeling more momentum in this space, right? I'm going to set aside X amount of hours this week to solely focus on that, and I'm going to remove all the other distractions. I'm knowing to set myself up for success to be working for it. I'm gonna ask for the help.

I'm gonna surround myself with the peers. I'm gonna ask for the accountability, whatever it may be, and then get her done- ... whether you feel like it or not. Because you have the choice, because you genuinely have the choice to do something when you don't feel like doing it.

Like, you still have a choice, right? So stop waiting- Come on. for motivation to come around, because it's not going to, and do yourself a damn favor because you deserve it and get the damn thing done. Yes.

Oh, my goodness. I love that. I think that it's so underrated thinking about how good it's gonna feel once you get there versus what's gonna feel good in the moment. Yes, I love that.

So after listening to this conversation, I, I know that people who are listening are thinking, "Okay, but, like, what do I do in each of these departments - ... to, to do this needle moving," right? Like- Yes. how do I actually take action in these different areas?

Um, and that's something we're gonna talk about. Yes. So, uh, at the time of recording this, we have a really exciting, uh, workshop coming up for you guys. I'm not gonna share the name yet.

I'm not going to share too many details yet. But I do want you to block off your calendar right now because it's gonna be coming up soon and it's gonna be a multi-day thing, and we're going to be diving deep into each of these departments to make sure that they are living up to the times. So that way, each of your departments are running well, smoothly, and they are matching consumer behavior today, but without burning you out, without the overwhelm, right? Um, that's what I'm all about is giving you the strategy, making it so you're putting things into place that make it so your business is above and beyond, is standing out, is being badass, while not sacrificing your personal life, and I really want you to make it.

So make sure right now in your calendar to block out May 4th through the 6th, 'cause we're gonna get down and dirty in this workshop, honey. And that's whether you are a student of mine already, or if you have never taken education with me before, you are gonna wanna be here. It's brand new content and it's going to be fucking badass. So get ready for it.

It's gonna be so good. And then we're also gonna be diving into each of these departments and highlighting some of those as kind of a, a preview for you, highlighting some of those things that you can do, uh, in the podcast over the next four weeks. Yeah, and that's probably what Jodi was prompting me to say anyway, so. So glad I jumped the gun with that.

But yeah, uh, over the next couple of weeks, we're gonna be diving more specifically into each of these departments to talk about specifically what to do in them, what, how, what, uh, numbers allude to your performance in each of these departments as well. So you can actually get a grasp on whether you are doing well in this department or not, or if it's what needs more focus or what doesn't need as much focus. Um, and specific topics within each of them that you guys a lot of the time ask me about or that are super relevant to today's day and age in 2025. Yeah, these topics are some of the things that tons of stylists are asking about on, on Instagram, so I can't wait to dive in.

It's gonna be so cool. Thank you so much for tuning into the Modern Hair Stylist podcast, my friend. Thank you so much for being here, Jodi, and prompting me and offering beautiful value. We appreciate you.

So much love. Peace out, girl scout. Bye-bye.

End of transcript. © 2025 Hunter Donia LLC.